Handling Larger Blocks of Space

Discussion in 'Noob Central' started by dynamik, Aug 9, 2011.

  1. dynamik

    dynamik Member

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    Hello,

    I'm looking for advice on handling larger blocks of IP space during mailing operations of TLD stuff.

    Say for instance, you've just acquired a /19.

    - How do you prep for that? Do you generally create a plan? I'm looking to hear advice on how someone treats their newly acquired blocks of space. What they do in place so their space does not reach past its limits and also so it doesn't under perform. I'd like to get anyones thoughts on this.

    Thanks
     
  2. DaMadHatter

    DaMadHatter Active Member

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    Location:
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    SWIPS
    Proper RDNS
    Do not use the whole range at once.

    :tee:
     
  3. dynamik

    dynamik Member

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    I hear that.

    But - being as critical as possible, can you explain the specifics why you wouldn't use the whole range at once?

    Are you saying this so you don't run through your whole inventory?

    Or

    Just don't use to the whole range at once on 1 specific ISP? If yes - Around how many IP's in a similiar range would be fine to hit a particular ISP in one day?

    Would you rotate various IP's daily in different blocks or would you try to keep things as solid/ongoing?

    I understand it's hard to generalize a lot of practices concerning delivery but I'd appreciate any additional information. I'm just looking to hear what other practices people involve asides from the typical getting swiped/rdns stuff.
     
  4. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    Depends on a few things.. Are you targeting a specific domain? Is the netspace pre-arin? Was the netspace properly acquired? If it is older space and you start swiping legacy/pre-arin space, arin may start asking questions and require you to jump through hoops or bye bye space.. If you announce a /19 that's legacy or hasn't been announced in awhile, you may end up with a spamhaus listing.. If you light up a /19 with full rdns and target GI you will end up with an SBL..... There are of course ways to avoid the fun and exciting designation of a 'snow shoe spam' listing.

    What has your typical operation been like ? How much IP space do you normally use? I would take what you know works and apply it to your new allocation..
     
  5. dynamik

    dynamik Member

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    You can come up with a strategy easy. Just make sure you're not hammering those fuckers.
     
  6. dynamik

    dynamik Member

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    Nickphx -

    It's not legacy space/pre-arin. The space has been around and is swiped. I'm not targeting GI much, mainly just hitting AOL, Hotmail, Gmail, Yahoo, ATT and some of the BB players.

    When you state 'There are of course ways to avoid the fun and exciting designation of a 'snow shoe spam' listing' can you elaborate? I'm going to assume the basis of your advice is obviously not to hammer the entire block/s concurrently and go toward a more asynchronous approach but if you could relay any other king of information?

    Well, typically we deal with non-contagious/sparse /27-25's - <750 IP's. This is why I raised the question, I'm dealing with this new relativity with the blocks which I'm trying to understand how to approach without getting overwhelmed or having the blocks under perform. Future ops will deal with >10,000 IP's, I'm just trying to get some clearer perspective here on the approach.
     
  7. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    To avoid snowshoe listings you would limit what ip space your rdns server(s) would respond to queries from.
     
  8. roundabout

    roundabout VIP

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    Oh you went there, and in an open forum, yikes, better head for the hills now!
     
  9. dynamik

    dynamik Member

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    Thanks for the tip, makes sense.

    Does anyone happen to have any other input regarding my inital subject/post?
     
  10. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    It's not exactly some sort of complex technical solution or uber secret idea nobody knows.. :33:
     
  11. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    If you're going to mail Y! I would utilize the whole block, sending small amounts across the entire range. If you go low and slow, you can maintain a consistent cash flow without racking up any TS03's or the exciting 553 of doom.
     
  12. ThisGuyOverHere

    ThisGuyOverHere VIP

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    This is true but we certainly dont want to give the impression we encourage or teach people how to do things like SnowShoe ranges.

    Given many peeps in industry go this route but we all know it's not the highest and best use of resources especially if you risk getting them yanked over a SnowShoe complaint.
     
  13. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    Spamhaus can eat a dick. How is it not the best use of resources to limit what ips can query reverse dns on IPs to avoid unnecessary attention?

    Do you not realize spamhaus has software monitoring IP announcements, domain registrations...? They constantly probe reverse dns and are very loose with their listings. You could potentially get listed without sending a single email.. That's fun!

    I don't mail dirty lists, I don't mail removes or suppression lists. I have never hit a spamhaus spam trap. I have had one 'snow shoe' listing from them because of some moron with poor mailing practices hit a trap causing spamhaus to probe the whole allocation.

    The OP asked for ideas on how to utilize a decent size allocation.. A few of the target domains they listed require reverse dns to send email to them. I felt it would be worthwhile to share a simple yet effective idea to avoid a potentially devastating headache.

    Oh yeah, spamhaus can eat a dick.
     
  14. mx10

    mx10 VIP

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    why the entire range instead of just 16-20 ips?
     
  15. PushSend

    PushSend VIP

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    ROFL - I like your style brother!

    :rofl:
     
  16. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    For Y! you spread it out.
     
  17. mx10

    mx10 VIP

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    as far as i can tell the limit per hour is 4000 regardless of if its 254 ips or 20 ips
     
  18. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    Ah well you're probably not changing up your content, from domain , or your link domains often. You also don't want to use all of the ips under a /24 at one time..
     
  19. dynamik

    dynamik Member

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    I appreciate your sound advice again, nickphx.

    This is where I'm still having a hard time getting my head around.

    Understanding how many IP's I should allocate from a large range of tight knight space for delivery in a single day to a single ISP.

    Obviously, you wouldn't want to hammer a server with an entire /19 if you want to keep the space healthy but what kind of approach would go torwards handling a block of this size (32 - /24's) for example, to give it a long positive lifespan assuming you're using great data?

    Like stated previously, maybe only utilize around 20 or so IP's from each /24 in the entire /19 (around 640 ip's from the /19)? Switch out the IP's the next day to a new set of 20 IP's the next day and let the previous rest? Where's the line for neighborhood allocation relativity which will cause red flags? How far can you push it before accelerated negativity happens on the range?

    Each ISP's principles are going to be different, sure. But, I'm looking to hear what some generic standards may be.

    I'd appreciate any other advice.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 13, 2011
  20. mx10

    mx10 VIP

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    just to be clear i was only asking about yahoo specifically because they sort of look at a /24 as "one ip", there is a total volume they will accept per block, regardless of how many ips you use in it
     

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