how to sustain GI

Discussion in 'Noob Central' started by Emmanuel Spitzer, Feb 10, 2016.

  1. Emmanuel Spitzer

    Emmanuel Spitzer New Member

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    So i just got robomail and its just in time for the newest spamhaus crackdown. Iv been sending about 1 million off of 1 ip and domain at a time and it takes about 2 hours to get all my mail out. Thats the first problem, as from what I gather, with a mailing platform you should be able to send 10 million or more in an hour. Is my problem tht im trying to send everything off 1 ip? would it be faster if i used multiple ips to spread out my mail? What is the model for gi mailers in terms of how many emails per ip and speed of mailing?

    Second problem is that im getting spamhaus dbl and css usually within 15 minutes of mailing, I impressionwised about 4 months ago, could it really have gotten that bad with traps in this time?

    My main problem i believe, is that i gather the concept of gi is to simply burn the domains and ips you send off every time you mail but if im getting blacklisted in 15 minutes how can i afford this especially since it seems as though i need to buy a .com for each ip or else i get blacklisted as soon as i set rdns. How can i afford to mail this way?

    I know its a lot of questions, i have more but i tried to do jsut the essentials now. Im not understand how people can make money with gi mailing with these issues.
     
  2. phdesign

    phdesign Active Member

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    I'm not sure there is a "new spamhaus crackdown" - they are always active...

    Your delivery speed isn't due to using a single IP, it is probably due to the server(s) you are using and possibly the host/bw you have. And, if you are bouncing a ton, it will also slow you down. Is your delivery speed fast before the DBL hits?

    Have you mailed since cleaning 4 months ago or is this your first time? Traps show up all the time. IW will only clean 100% of the traps they know about. The only way you will find remaining trap(s) is to mail the data. If you really want to narrow it down, you can segregate your data into smaller sublists. Mail each sublist separately until you hit the trap(s). So suppose you broke it down to 50k... you can then break that down further to 10k or 5k and mail those separately until you find the trap. At some point you just throw away the sublist and move on... until you get another one.
     
  3. nickphx

    nickphx VIP

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    DBL can happen regardless of data quality.
     
  4. guidito

    guidito VIP

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    you should try something that sends faster, like gain250. we can send at 300k/min and faster
     
  5. Emmanuel Spitzer

    Emmanuel Spitzer New Member

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    you can send that much off of 1 ip and domain?
     
  6. nymailer

    nymailer VIP

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    if you're sending to bounces you could hurt your delivery speed also, 4 months is quite a long time to have no data hygiene, a lot of mailers do it daily.
     
  7. Jumper

    Jumper Member

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    do the hygiene companies update their databases that often? I assume you have to either have a feedback portal from other mailers, or mail yourself to detect the traps. Kind of strange how these companies get their data.
     
  8. nymailer

    nymailer VIP

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    yea they update their databases daily, I'm sure they compile from a network of mailers and then reverse engineer traps. I have my own way of trap detection but I do use impressionwise time to time
     
  9. cpastar

    cpastar New Member

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    May I know what does GI (General Internet) mean? Is it data scrap from internet?
    Is it low level tld's?
    I do PDL, we have LF and SF. Just never seen GI :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2016
  10. getstarted

    getstarted VIP

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    Hi
    It is a generic term used for general domains. (A lot of people call aol, hotmail , etc tld's)

    So Exp. joeblow.com , getthe 234.com, whatever.com. that would be GI
     
  11. DoldGigga

    DoldGigga VIP

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    There's a lot you can do before you even send GI data, like profiling the domain MX and making sure that the MX reported for the domain of the email isn't just forwarding to a trap, or to a TLD/cable domain. It may not even be intentional, a lot of people buy a domain and then MX forward to their ISP email or whatever and that could be tripping you up. Basically with GI you want to be focused on mailing to actual GI domains that are privately owned and not forwarded.

    The rate at which you can send is dependent on the server. A dinky bare-bones VPS or cloud unit will get bogged down, mainly due to I/O issues. Are you logging? If you are, you'll want a raid-0 array. If you don't have that, set it to log 5xx errors only. The other issue is how well your DNS is optimized for handling the torrent of SPF,RDNS and DKIM queries being tossed at it...may as well not use DKIM, it's kinda pointless and on CPUs that do not have aes-ni enabled (i.e. not intel i7 or xeon) it can slow sending down substantially.

    But yes, 1 IP / 1 domain is fine for sending 10 million / hr if your list is comprised of unique domains. I bet it's not. How many unique domains are in your list? Maybe 5000? If it is 5000 and it's evenly distributed, that would average to 2K per hour per domain which is well above the threshold for even the most reluctant spam software to trip some basic rejection policies.

    As you can see, graduating 3rd grade helps when it comes to email marketing, because it lets you do complex math like 10,000,000 / 5,000 = 2,000.

    Impressionwised? That sounds rough and it could have gotten that bad. Any time you're sending new GI data, whatever domain/IP combo you use for your first few drops is probably going to get burned...unless you process FBLs, remove 5xx bounces and the manually request to be unlisted from any BL you end up on.

    If that's what you believe then why not just hire russians to spam on your behalf? If you actually want to mail on a regular basis without having to churn and burn, you'll probably want to think more along the lines of how you can preserve your resources rather than sacrificing them. Even a handful of IPs with solid rep is a goldmine sending 1-3 million per day rather than trying to shit out 10 million on IPs that are burnt.

    They make money with GI by not having these issues.
     
  12. Jumper

    Jumper Member

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    Is there a noticeable difference between sending GI vs TLD? I am currently mailing both together and thought about separation, but haven't seen a need. I always see how IPs are advertised as only TLD and no GI. I guess the send rate seems greater for GI.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2016
  13. DoldGigga

    DoldGigga VIP

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    Most of the time, IPs that were used for GI mailing will not deliver effectively to TLD because GI is full of traps that are nearly impossible to avoid. If your list is small you can get away with sharing IPs but generally speaking you should have your GI mailing on its own subnet.
     
  14. Jumper

    Jumper Member

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    What do experienced mailers do when SpamAssassin hits your send domain? I have implemented RDNS, but that domain is getting toasted with some trial drops. I was thinking of placing another domain on top of the RDNS one.

    Any suggestions?
     
  15. HelloMails

    HelloMails New Member

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  16. phdesign

    phdesign Active Member

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    Listen to (read) what was already said above. If you are mailing GI, you are going to get your domains and IPs blacklisted regardless of how much Big4 and Cables you have mixed in there. I have GI data cleaned through 2 hygiene companies and inevitably still hit traps and get blacklisted. I won't say it's impossible to keep a clean list of GI, but it darn near is. Separate the GI out and mail it on separate IPs and domains you can lose and replace. Meanwhile, build some rep with your IPs you're going to keep for Big4 and Cables.
     
  17. Jumper

    Jumper Member

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    I thought traps were in Big4 as well. Will take the suggestion and change my process. Thanks!
     
  18. phdesign

    phdesign Active Member

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    Sure, there are traps in Big4 too. Good to use hygiene on your data regardless. I think you'll find you keep domains and IPs much longer when you get it separated out. Best luck.
     
  19. Jumper

    Jumper Member

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    Thanks for the help
     
  20. massMailer

    massMailer Member

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    wow solid knowledge in a single thread, I am mailing GI and TLD and after reading this thread i really feel like a dumb kid mailing randomly lol
    knowledge is being dropped :D

    great info guys thankxx!!
     

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